A Fire Commissioner's Firsthand Account of 9/11

0:00 Speaker 1 Labor Day weekend. Well, next week, 9-11. A very special day. 25 years since 9-11 where we lost so many firemen, so many policemen. And with us today is Tom Van Essen. And he was the fire commissioner, the 30th fire commissioner of the city in New York under Mayor Rudy Giuliani. And, well.

0:31 Commissioner, tell us, you know, it’s 25 years next Friday. Tell us how you feel and give us an update of all the people you lost. And just give us an update on how you’re feeling 25 years later, too.

0:47 Speaker 2 Well, thanks, John. And thank you for all you do for the city and for everybody. I always hear you say common sense. There’s a lot of truth in that. I was just on a phone call with FEMA, and they’re preparing something for the USAR team, Urban Search and Rescue.

1:07 And it was showing pictures of Ray Downey, and it was a great part of FDNY and an integral part of FEMA also, the urban search and rescue teams. And it just brings back the horrible memories of that day and the pride that I have being part of that group of men and what they did that day. I

1:28 remember being in the North Tower building. and we felt the vibration, and we thought it was in the elevator shafts, an explosion with the fuel, but it wasn’t. It was the South Tower being hit. We couldn’t see anything. We didn’t know what was going on. Somebody came running in and said, Commissioner, the South Tower was hit, the Mall

1:48 of America was hit, and the Sears Tower was hit, which was all inaccurate, of course, except the South Tower. So Ray Downey walked past me on his way to the South Tower, and he said to me, Boss, you know, these buildings can come down. And I’ll never forget his eyes and his confidence and his ability as he was

2:08 walking out. It wasn’t like, Tommy, get the hell out of here or anything like that. It was these buildings can come down. And I had the best fire chiefs in the world. I mean, they’re not great managers, but they’re great fire chiefs. And they were doing a terrific job in that building, trying to get everybody out already.

2:26 you know, trying to get the firefighters that once they realized it was commercial jet and not a small plane, like we originally thought. So now they’re rushing to get everybody out and Ray takes half the team and goes to the South tower and never saw him again. And I was on something today with his son who’s been

2:44 in the fire department 40 years and now has his job running rescue operations. And I know Pete Gansey’s son is on the job and Bill Feehan’s son is on the job. And it’s just so Eddie Garrity. And one guy after another has sons on the job who loved it so much, wanted to help strangers so much, was

3:05 so proud of their heritage, of their father’s. that they couldn’t wait to get on and they couldn’t wait to serve. So I always felt like an obligation to those families that survived to try to do everything I could to carry on the tradition of pride and strength and honor that these guys had and that I was part of

3:28 for 32 years. I was a firefighter for about 18 years, 16 years or so, I guess, in the South Bronx mostly. and the rest of the time in the union and in the commissioner’s job. So I got to see all of it and have a load of respect and admiration for all of them.

3:45 Speaker 1 Commissioner, it’s the first time I heard this part of the story that he said to you that the buildings can’t come down. I didn’t realize that anybody, any of you realized that those buildings will come down.

4:04 Speaker 2 Yeah, and I think, you know, like I say, these chiefs, they were as good as they get. And none of them thought that those buildings were going to come down, be hit, and come down in 102 minutes. And that’s what it took, an hour and 42 minutes from the first plane hit to the second tower falling. That is

4:21 a very, very short period of time for 210-story buildings. And I’ve spoken all around the world and I’ve heard engineers sitting in the room and tell me, you should have known those buildings are going to come down. And sometimes I want to go in the back of the room and like bang their head on the concrete, you know,

4:38 because they’re sitting in a laboratory with a scientific formula in front of them. And they’re not dealing like my guys were dealing in a building on the first floor of 110 stories, not knowing how much damage, not knowing how much fuel, not knowing anything. So there was no way of them predicting how fast those buildings are going

4:57 to come down. And that, I will always have solace in that, knowing that if Ray Downey said they’ll come down, but he didn’t mean in the next 102 minutes, then nobody else knows any better.

5:09 Speaker 1 And Commissioner, the other thing is, you know, I lost four friends and one of my cousins who’s named after me, John Katsimatidis. And that those buildings came down, 110-story buildings came down In less than five stories. And nobody, I don’t think anybody really expected what happened.

5:32 Speaker 2 Yeah. I remember going to Gracie Mansion that night, Mayor Giuliani. You know, we were going all day and then all night. And we had a meeting late. I forget what time it was at Gracie Mansion. He had experts from the federal government and, you know, the scientific community and everybody.

5:46 And a scientist said to me, he said, you know, you’re not going to have any survivors. And this was that night. And I looked at Mayor Giuliani and said, boss, we can’t say that we have no survival. We don’t know.

5:59 I had visions of a piece of steel and concrete laying up against it and some guy or some lady laying under it trapped with some air coming in and water dripping like you see on TV or they pull somebody out a week later and a collapse in Nepal or something like that. But ours was different. Our concrete

6:19 was just pulverized. The steel was so heavy.

6:22 Speaker 1 And you’re right.

6:22 Speaker 2 I mean, it was five floors. But don’t forget, we had eight floors underground. So that stuff just compressed and there was no way anybody was going to survive that.

6:31 Speaker 1 Then the other building came down.

6:34 Speaker 2 What happened was there was a fire in it early and we knew it, but we had nobody to put it out. We just made a decision. We’re going to let it burn. I don’t know. I don’t think we’ve ever done that before or since in New York City.

6:46 where we didn’t have the resources to try and put a fire out. Everybody that reported down to the Trade Center, of course, we were using to try and find survivors. The guys were immediately going through the pile. It was like an architectural dig, or what do you call it, a geological dig, where we had pails and buckets and

7:06 just pulling stuff apart. We had no heavy equipment or anything yet. So we were just worried about finding survivors. We weren’t worried about Seven World Trade Center. We knew everybody was out of it. They made a decision very early on. The engineer or somebody in that building was very smart, and he evacuated the building way before they

7:23 had any serious damage or anything, and we just let it burn down, and it collapsed that night, I guess, 6, 7, 8 o’clock, something like that.

7:31 Speaker 1 Wow. I mean, this is a very emotional interview that we’re doing together, and I’ve never spoken to you about this before on this subject. What else? Did anything else surprise you? I mean, that when we talked about the two trade centers coming down straight down into oblivion and we talked about the seven world trade center, anything else

7:59 you want to tell the American people that surprised you that day?

8:04 Speaker 2 You know, John, it was I was surprised that. it was so final. In other words, you know, you see something come down, you see a tip or it falls and people are, you know, able to get out. I mean, everybody who got out of that building got out before it came down, you know? And it was just, for me,

8:27 the biggest surprise and the hardest part of the whole thing, I mean... you’re a businessman and you solve problems. And I was not a businessman, but I was a problem solver. And that was the best part of the job, you know, helping people and fixing stuff. And the families, the grief, the pain, the suffering that the mothers and fathers and

8:45 wives and families went through, I’ve never seen anything like that. And it’s still with me today. The more I just think about a particular individual or his family or his son or what left. And I think how lucky I’ve been these 25 years, all my grandchildren and stuff, And I think of what they’ve missed. And that’s the part.

9:05 The biggest surprise for me was I think we, you know, it was bad enough losing your loved one. But when we couldn’t give them remains, it was even worse. And you say, like, well, how could it be worse? You know, Tom died. You say, no, it was worse because we couldn’t even give them Tom’s remains. We had to tell

9:23 the loved one that we can’t give you your loved one. And that was the worst part of it. went on for weeks and months.

9:33 Speaker 1 Commissioner Tom Van Essen, thank you so much for coming on this Sunday morning just before 9-11, Labor Day weekend. And let’s pray for the souls of all our friends that we lost and let’s hope it never happens again and let’s never forget what happened on 9-11, 2001.

9:52 Speaker 2 You know, John, I think we have forgotten. When I think of 19 evil men that caused all this problem, and now we’ve got thousands of people in our country. We don’t know who they are, where they are, why they’re here. I don’t think we did a very good job of not forgetting. I don’t think we’ve given them

10:14 the respect that they deserve because it could easily happen again. As much as technology has improved, the technology has improved for the bad guys also. So I wouldn’t count it out.

10:28 Speaker 1 Let’s work together to make sure it doesn’t happen. Thank you so much.

10:33 Speaker 2 Thank you, John.